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Oculus Spirit [82626]
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Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 11:23 AM
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In the past, we've seen CJ Spiller get robbed from not even getting an invite to the presentation. Imo, the primary reasons that we've been overlooked is because 1. Players hadn't gotten enough publicity 2. Clemson teams didn't win enough games
As a true freshman, TL was the qb on the first 15-0 team and he absolutely shredded the best bama team ever in the championship game in prime time on national tv. So everyone knows who he is. He's got rock star publicity and folks are now surprised if Clemson actually loses a game, so Clemson is not only winning but we are doing it in dominant fashion. Trevor's actually going to improve! Can you imagine that?
He's got the publicity and Clemson dominates in the win column and this is why I think that Trevor Lawrence will be Clemson's first Heisman Trophy winner.
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Legend [15641]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 11:28 AM
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I like the way you think, and I agree.
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All-TigerNet [13454]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 11:36 AM
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I hope he wins 2 and gives one to Deshaun.....
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110%er [6662]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 11:38 AM
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Why I think he won't win the Heisman. Dabo won't leave him in long enough to get 8 TDs against Charlotte and he won't have the gaudy stats others will simply because he won't play the 4th quarter very often.
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Team Captain [480]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 11:44 AM
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They already hd tua's name written on the trophy before he got hurt, and he hadn't taken a single 4th quarter snap.
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All-In [26776]
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He was wearing a crimson color jersey
Jul 23, 2019, 12:04 PM
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TLaw is not.
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson
Jul 23, 2019, 11:42 AM
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players have gotten robbed. I think the best case we had was 2015 DW4 and that one honestly should've gone to Christian McCaffrey. Henry would've been 3rd for me if I had a vote.
Thought Lamar was pretty deserving in 2016 and I think just how much of a disaster they were without him in 2018 only strengthens that argument. He was practically a one man show there and he played behind a crappy OL.
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CU Medallion [64841]
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You're definitely in the minority on that one...
Jul 23, 2019, 11:53 AM
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Heck, several Heisman voters have since admitted they got it wrong and the award should have gone to Watson.
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110%er [6825]
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Re: You're definitely in the minority on that one...
Jul 23, 2019, 1:04 PM
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I think that is the problem of when the award is given. At the time it was given, Lamar had the better case.
Lamar earned it hands-down before the bowl games. He was the reason why they were at 9 wins as compared to 2 wins. Heck, just watch the FSU game (when we thought FSU still had a pulse) and he might single-handedly toppled the Jimbo-FSU machine. He put the dysfunction on display! Sadly (& luckily) defenses cracked the Lamar code at the very end of the season (aka make the rest of the team beat you).
Now, after December, it was DW4 all the way as Deshaun "Heisman" moment(s) came against Alabama. We all know the DW4 is better...
For the Heisman, you best game needs to be in Sept/Oct. Our QBs best game was in the Championship. I prefer it that way but more trophies are always welcomed.
However, there was one tiger with a September/October case:
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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This is exactly right. The problem with the Heisman right
Jul 23, 2019, 1:35 PM
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now (well the biggest problem of many) is that the voting is done too soon.
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All-TigerNet [10835]
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Re: I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson
Jul 23, 2019, 12:03 PM
[ in reply to I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson ] |
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Action Jackson was awesome the first two months of 2016 and then did less and less the rest of the way. DW4 should have won it.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson
Jul 23, 2019, 12:15 PM
[ in reply to I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson ] |
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I have mixed feelings on this. On one hand, Louisville did do a lot of stat padding in blowout games with him which is cheap IMO. On the other hand, he did carry that team while putting up huge numbers even before padding the stats. That team had no business taking us down to the final play on the road that year. We had the crowd at night, we had the better defense, the better coaching staff, and we had the better playmakers on offense, and he still nearly pulled it off for them. He didn't finish the season as strong, but he still had a lot of yards in pretty much every game down the stretch except for the Houston game.
Watson was no doubt the better player, but his numbers dropped from the year before largely because our offense got off to a slow start that season, and he threw a lot of interceptions. I hate it for Watson that he never got a Heisman, but I just can't get angry about it like so many others.
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Legend [18069]
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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Yes because until the Heisman changes the date of the award
Jul 23, 2019, 1:32 PM
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the playoffs are not counted. In it's current form it's purely a regular season award. At the end of the regular season i think Lamar Jackson still had a much stronger case than Watson.
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Team Captain [482]
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Re: I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson
Jul 23, 2019, 3:13 PM
[ in reply to I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson ] |
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I 100% agree. Should have been mccaffery in 2015 and Jackson in 2016. If the voting was after post season Watson may have had 2.
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All-In [29058]
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One small correction
Jul 23, 2019, 3:24 PM
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If the voters hadn't voted early Watson likely wins it in 16. Even disregarding postseason play, the voters didn't wait until the end of the regular season to vote. Down the stretch Jackson was looking mortal and Watson was looking much better (IMO).
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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It is really ridiculous that some votes get cast before the
Jul 23, 2019, 5:20 PM
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regular season even ends. Ideally they just move the vote until after the CFP and award the Heisman in late January or something, but if they insist on keeping it a regular season award they should at least have to wait until after conference championship weekend to vote.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: It is really ridiculous that some votes get cast before the
Jul 23, 2019, 6:16 PM
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I can’t think of any major sport where the MVP award, or in this case the Heisman is anything other than a regular season award. Do some of you just want it to go to the best player on the NC winning team every year?
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110%er [5072]
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Re: One small correction
Jul 23, 2019, 6:19 PM
[ in reply to One small correction ] |
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If it’s true that a lot of people voted early, and true in your opinion that they would’ve otherwise voted for Watson had they waited, then why didn’t those voters change their votes? I can’t imagine there’s a rule stating that they can’t, nor can I imagine that it would be all that complicated to do so.
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Legend [18124]
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I'm in the minority as well
Jul 23, 2019, 3:58 PM
[ in reply to I know I'm in the minority but I don't think any Clemson ] |
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Its a regular season award and they do allow for early voting. So them is the rules.
I think McCaffrey should have won in 2015. Period.
2016 is more of a toss up ... DW and LJ supporters both have arguments.
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All-In [26776]
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Wont happen ... media drives the narrative ...
Jul 23, 2019, 12:02 PM
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this year it will be "the best player against the best competition".
TLaw will not win because of the "weak ACC" narrative.
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All-TigerNet [10835]
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Re: Wont happen ... media drives the narrative ...
Jul 23, 2019, 12:04 PM
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Why wasn't that the narrative when Action Jackson won it in 2016?
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All-In [26776]
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That's what I'm saying ... they adjust based on who they
Jul 23, 2019, 12:06 PM
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want to win.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: Wont happen ... media drives the narrative ...
Jul 23, 2019, 12:17 PM
[ in reply to Re: Wont happen ... media drives the narrative ... ] |
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Or when Winston won it recently, or how Oklahoma has won it 2 straight years even though the narrative is that the Big 12 doesn't play defense. Not sure that I buy into this conspiracy at all.
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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All-TigerNet [10822]
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the ACC was the best conference in 2016
Jul 23, 2019, 5:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: Wont happen ... media drives the narrative ... ] |
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Even though the media wants you to forget it. Everyone loves to crap on the ACC and act like That’s how it’s always been. The conference had a down year last year.
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Orange Blooded [2203]
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I don't think he will win because
Jul 23, 2019, 12:09 PM
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they like to vote for the QB that loves to take off running. Let's face it, it's exciting for fans when it looks like a play is dead and the QB takes off running. The voters are influenced by this. Look at Kyler Murray, Lamar Jackson, Johnny Manziel. TL will hands-down be the best player this season. But they will give it to a QB who looks more flashy.
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All-TigerNet [10835]
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Re: I don't think he will win because
Jul 23, 2019, 12:11 PM
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The Heistman Trophy.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: I don't think he will win because
Jul 23, 2019, 12:19 PM
[ in reply to I don't think he will win because ] |
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There have been a lot of mobile quarterbacks winning it lately, but I think that's more to do with there not really being a non-mobile QB recently that has put up huge passing stats on a top team.
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1st Rounder [640]
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Re: I don't think he will win because
Jul 23, 2019, 1:54 PM
[ in reply to I don't think he will win because ] |
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while you're on to something, i wouldn't assume he won't win because he doesn't run enough. Mariotta and Mayfield aren't exactly in the same class as Murray and Jackson. If Lawrence produces, he'll be in the conversation. Whether he wins or not comes down to his showings in big games, or if he goes for 500 yards against someone.
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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Kyler Murray had incredible passing numbers last year
Jul 23, 2019, 2:32 PM
[ in reply to I don't think he will win because ] |
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It doesn't hurt that he ran for 1000 yards, but his passing numbers alone were enough to earn him a trip to NY.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 12:26 PM
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His name is out there which gives him a great chance. I think his chances will largely depend on a few things. 1) How much does ETN cut into his numbers with rushing yards and touchdowns? I think both would have a good shot at winning it, but there is a chance of cancelling each other out.
2) How well does our defense play? If our offense rolls as expected, and our defense is playing anything close to last year then Lawrence may find himself sitting on the sidelines midway through the 3rd quarter in several games. However, if our defense struggles a bit in some earlier games this year then Lawrence could be asked to stay in and put up bigger numbers much in the way of Murray last year at Oklahoma.
3) How well he plays in our few bigger games this year such as A&M. The eyes will be glued to those games, and those are often where the Heisman moments are made.
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All-In [26410]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 12:33 PM
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Unfortunately, ESPN determines who wins the Heisman because of their propaganda machine. ESPN generally does not like Clemson because they are not in The SEC, Big 10 , Notre Dame or Southern Cal. He would have to be the front runner by a large margin to gain their support in my opinion.
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110%er [5072]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 1:42 PM
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The last 3, and 5 out of the last 6 Heisman winners have come from outside of the group you just mentioned.
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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Hmm lets see
Jul 23, 2019, 2:42 PM
[ in reply to Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy ] |
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2018 - Kyler Murray 2017 - Baker Mayfield 2016 - Lamar Jackson 2014 - Marcus Mariota 2013 - Jameis Winston 2011 - Robert Griffin III
You might want to tweak your list a little because very few recent Heisman winners have played at any of the programs you mentioned. The entire Big Ten hasn't had a Heisman winner since 2006! USC last won one in 2005 (now vacated and officially 2004). Notre Dame hasn't had a winner since 1987!
Sure the SEC has won a few, but were any of them really controversial aside from Henry in 2015? Manziel, Newton, and Tebow were all no-brainers IMO, and Mark Ingram had an incredible year with very little competition in 2009.
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Legend [16186]
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Not much to see.
Jul 23, 2019, 3:07 PM
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The Heisman Trophy sucks. The Heisman has been awarded to far from the best player so many years that it's become unrelated to the quality of the players in the country. Watson was the best player in the country two years in a row and those ##### gave the award to Henry and Jackson.
I'd go back a few decades, and compare who won the HT to the best player in the country, but frankly I don't give a crap about that award anymore. It's as significant to me as the Grantland Rice Trophy.
If Trevor wins it twice, I might change my mind, but probably not.
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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Still disagree on that. Watson didn't play well enough in
Jul 23, 2019, 5:17 PM
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2016 during the regular season to win the Heisman. And you really can't blame that on anti-Clemson bias or lack of publicity or anything because he was basically the Heisman front-runner and the face of CFB heading into 2016. He had all of the hype and then just flat out didn't play well in the first 4 games of the season while Lamar Jackson was absolutely lighting it up.
Also thought McCaffrey was the best player in 2015 (who also didn't win), but that was certainly Watson's best case. I think he did deserve to finish ahead of Henry who's only elite trait at Alabama was durability.
One of my biggest issues with the Heisman is that a guy like Suh didn't win in 2009. He was clearly the best player in all of CFB that year and he didn't get a fair shake simply because he played defense. Even on the offensive side of the ball i don't think a WR has won since the 80s.
My top 2 wishes to improve the Heisman: 1) Move the voting until after the playoff. 2) Give EVERYONE a fair shake at the award, not just QBs and the occasional RB. They could probably also do a better job of giving ballots to qualified voters.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 12:41 PM
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If I had made the bad decisions that the Heisman Committee have made when I was in business, I would have been fired numerous times for being an idiot. That committee needs to be disbanded, never to be allowed to vote on anything sports-related in their lives. A blind guy with a handful of darts could make better choices.
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Orange Blooded [2217]
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He’s not going to win for 2 reasons:
Jul 23, 2019, 1:08 PM
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1.) He won’t be in for insane stats because he won’t be in games long enough 2.) ETN will cannibalize each other’s votes and Heisman voting gets pretty regional especially if Oregon (Herbert), Texas (Ehlinger), and OSU/Michigan (Fields/Patterson) all have good years and the feeling in the Deep South that Tua should have won last year. Also have Fromm to deal with too. Trevor is better than all of those guys but he also has the most competition on his team and in his region.
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All-In [26776]
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Heisman House commercials with a Clemson player ?
Jul 23, 2019, 1:54 PM
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What would George Rogers do for a living ?
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Hall of Famer [22965]
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lmao***
Jul 23, 2019, 2:21 PM
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All-In [27366]
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Yes, he certainly SHOULD win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 2:46 PM
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But I certainly wouldn't put any money on it after all the years I've observed the charade.
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Hall of Famer [23099]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 3:26 PM
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Barring injury, here is why I think he will win it. (I'll just add to your list.)
He has amazing talent around him at the skill positions. No team in the country can equal, much less surpass the talent at WR.
If Etienne is not the best RB in college football, I want to see anyone better. (In fact, it could be that Etienne is so good, HE might win the Heisman.)
TL has a full year of experience running the offense. All his primary weapons have also had a full season running the offense and working with him in the offense. He kept getting better and better as the season progressed. I see no reason why he won't run the offense even more effectively and efficiently this season.
He will be on the field more than last year because the defense will not be as dominant. There may be a few more 30 point wins rather than 40 point blowouts. Still dominant wins, but close enough for him to play another possession or two and put up even better stats than last year.
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Legend [16532]
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I can see voters overlooking non-gaudy volume for gaudy
Jul 23, 2019, 7:11 PM
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efficiency. Especially with the winning alongside, if all of that continues.
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110%er [6578]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 6:10 PM
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Why I think he won't? He has good character. He plays for us. He plays in ACC. He is not a thug. (Thug seems to be prerequisite for winning. Thug is not based on race. Johnny football was the biggest thug.)
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110%er [5072]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 6:37 PM
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The ACC has won it twice in the last 6 years. A thug by definition is a violent person, what violent actions have recent winners such as Murray, Jackson, Henry, Mariota,
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110%er [5072]
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Re: Why I think that Trevor Lawrence will win the Heisman Trophy
Jul 23, 2019, 6:38 PM
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RG3, or even Mayfield, or Manziel been apart of?
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All-TigerNet [13090]
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Replies: 47
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